Interview: Tasso Azevedo, Senior Advisor to the Ministry of the Environment

"Brazil has a winning model for combating deforestation"

Tasso Azevedo, Senior Advisor to the Ministry of the Environment and Former General Director of the Brazilian Forest Service, says that Brazil has the necessary technology and governance to enable REDD projects in the country to succeed

Secretariat for Social Communication of the Presidency of Brazil

On what basis the actions for REDD are being discussed in the scope of the United Nations Framework Convention?

REED is the word that we use in the scope of the Convention to talk about Reducing Emissions from Deforestation and Forest Degradation. That is to say, all the actions that we implement that helps to promote direct or indirectly the reduction of deforestation and degradation of the forest and, therefore the reduction of greenhouse gases emissions derived from these processes can be called REDD action. The Action Plan for Prevention and Control of the Legal Amazon Deforestation (PPCDAM) is an example of REDD action as well as all of its components. 

However, what is actually being debated in the Climate Conference is the incentive mechanism so that REDD happens in the context of a global climate agreement. How they are going to be financed and which way the countries will be able use these projects to achieve its mandatory obligations of greenhouse gases reduction. All of this taking into consideration the local populations that should have the opportunity to develop social and economically, taking care of the forest.

It is worth remembering that the REED initiatives are included in the Nationally Appropriated Mitigation Actions (NAMA), which are the commitments of the developing countries to the change of the greenhouse gases emissions' trajectory. For instance, Brazil is growing and should adopt a development model that does not generate an expressive increase of gases in the atmosphere. In order to make this happen, Brazil has to reduce the pace of its emissions through national actions. And, in order to make this happen, it can reduce the methane from cattle in national scale, and it can increase the use of ethanol as a clean fuel and, in the case of REDD, reduce the deforestation. So, REDD is NAMA, but for having more specific characteristics, already well discussed and advanced has a differentiated treatment in the negotiation.

In the core of all of this is the financing. The rich countries must provide financial support so that the developing countries may execute its NAMAs and then change its development model without losing the opportunity to grow.

What is the Brazilian position on financing this REDD mechanism?

Brazil believes that there is space for the three existent options: money from the countries' Treasury (donations), resources from the market (non-compensatory and compensatory).

The non-compensatory market has and it will have more volume in the beginning. By this proposal, when a permission to emit is sold, this resource goes to the countries' Treasury and then part of this money can be sent to the developing countries to be used in the NAMAs and, of course, in REDD projects.

Brazil also accepts to discuss the option of the compensatory market. However, as long as we have ensured that, in the end, the overall account of global emissions reduction is enough to ensure that the planet's temperature does not increase over 2°C. It is fundamental to define that the developed countries will only be able to compensate their emissions if they comply with their domestic cut goals, in other vital sector, like energy.

Each country has a reality and the challenge is exactly the closing of an agreement so that these mechanisms contemplate what each part wants. What are the Brazilian peculiarities that are being considered in this debate?

Certainly, all countries are putting on the table their priorities.

In the case of Brazil, our main challenge is to overcome the current reality that the cut forests are more economically valuable than the standing forests. To solve this problem, we want to implement financing mechanisms that incentive the sustainable use of the forest. In order to make this happen, there are several possible actions, like decreasing the interest rate for investments in the forest area, stimulating the management activity that use correct and less aggressive techniques to withdraw the tree, ensuring minimum price for forest products and the stimulation of the integration agriculture-cattle to avoid new areas of pasture.

Moreover, Brazil's REDD projects should also contribute to widen up the monitoring and control actions. Not only in the Amazon, but in all of the biomes. The Cerrado (Brazilian Savannah) also presents high deforestation rates. The biome loses are of an area of 15 thousand Km³ every year.

In a third part, the country wants to solve its agrarian issues. The Government should clearly define who is the owner in each area of the Amazon. With this response in hands, the use of land should be defined. Will it be Conservation Unit, Indigenous Land or area of economic activity?

Brazil also defends that the REED mechanism to be approved in Copenhagen includes actions already existent and not only those that will start to be executed after the international agreement. What are the arguments for this position?

This is a key issue for Brazil. This instrument should incorporate who never deforested and also who does not deforest anymore. After all, we have many concrete actions and results, from a great effort that started in 2004 with the creation of the transversal public policies to combat the deforestation in the Amazon.

It is important to understand that the maintenance of the deforestation reduction has a cost. It is not only a matter of resources to reduce, but also to give continuity to the work.

Therefore, we defend that the "early actions", that are the pioneer ones, executed even before the international agreement, are recognized and receive resources.

To deal with this situation, Brazil created the Amazon Fund, which has a pioneer characteristic and is recognized worldwide. Every time that the emissions from deforestation reduce, greater are the conditions for this fund to receive resources.

It is a private fund, but sovereign. Norway, which made an important contribution of one billion dollars, has the following judgment: "If you are reducing the deforestation, it means that you were efficient and that you are serving the world. We want to contribute to the continuity of this effort". Brazil has built a very important structure that has been worked since 2004, when the The Action Plan for Prevention and Control of the Legal Amazon Deforestation (PPCDAM) was launched.

Which is the REDD implementation model that Brazil considers to be the most adequate?

The countries are in very different stages and conditions, and that is why we believe that the mechanisms should be implemented in three stages.

In the first stage, the countries will receive resources to get prepared throughout the pilot-projects. In the second stage, some results should already be presented, even that it does not exist quantification neither a detailed monitoring and verification system that informs with exact precision how many tons of carbon has been reduced.

In the third stage, the countries will receive incentives and should prove that through monitoring, reporting and verification the exact quantity of carbon is being reduced. The country receives by the proved and demonstrated reduction. Due to our efforts and concrete results, Brazil is already able to enter in this stage.

What is Brazil's differential in technology and governance to implement REDD projects?

First of all, the best world monitoring system of tropical forest. We have monthly and annually information. This technology is, actually, being transferred to other countries. To give an idea, 20% of the Amazon Fund's resources are available to help other countries to create a monitoring system.

As for the governance, Brazil has built a very important structure that has been worked since 2004, when the The Action Plan for Prevention and Control of the Legal Amazon Deforestation (PPCDAM) was launched. The Federal Government involved other ministries and sphere of the Government.